So why did they do it? Political reasons, the RCC has become as the world as Pius XII warned us shortly before his death, (his successor John XXIII canonized today) Pius XII spoke even before that what was to become of the Church. He was right. So no Catholic go saying love it or leave it. I love the faith but not what the Church has become. I shall not leave the faith but I can't prevent the Church from doing so.
I stood; and in the distance I saw a hideous creature (Satan) saying "Rebuild the Church and build it strong, with no angels on guard, and I shall tear it down."
What an ominous warning!
Update for Res: The Lambs Supper If you want to know about what the Mass means for your own edification, I highly recommend this book written by a former Protestant minister, who went to a High Mass and sat in the back and what he saw with his knowledge of the Bible blew him away. He went there for other motives and walked out a different person about the RCC and converted later.
I'm not a fan of the RCC, as you know. Why are they as a group so eager to run away from the standards that they have claimed as doctrine for so may centuries? I'm not asking this to be critical of your faith. I don't understand why they are running away from things that were taught as immutable.
ReplyDeleteFWIW this is happening in many protestant churches too. As a part of that group I see and understand the reasons they give. I don't go along with them. I just understand.
Res, it is in the Bible. toward the end of times there will be a great apostasy (a falling away). It's prophecy. That's the why, and he has a name. Not being a fan of the RCC has nothing to do with it.
ReplyDeleteI would guess most people who line up theologically on the protestant side would say the ordination of saints needs a second look. I'm not trying to argue the point. The veneration of saints isn't part of my theology so I don't have a dog in this fight.
ReplyDeleteYour point about apostasy is well taken.
I'm surprised that the leadership of the RCC made this move. As I remember it, being added to the list of official saints is supposed to be a recognition of a fact that would still be true if the RCC recognized that person, or not. I don't see what the church gains (or loses if they don't) if they add two more men to the list. Perhaps my confusion is simply the ignorance of an outsider to the inter workings of the organization.
No your view as an outsider are correct in that you saw the problem of the modernizing Church. That is the key point here. It is not so much that they did this it is the reason they did it thus the title of the post "Political Saints". It was done out of a worldly view of sainthood, like voting for a president of an association. It was a popularity contest and was also an attempt to tell the orthodoxy that Vatican II was not only correct but worthy of formal sainthood for doing it. It backfired, it just pissed me off and further breached my faith in the current organization. I hope that explains it for you. I was angered.
ReplyDeleteI'll tell you something else Res. The Mass is supposed to be solemn and that's the reason for the sitting, standing and kneeling during different parts of the Mass. The Liturgical and the Sacramental. People aren't supposed to be holding hands during the Lords Prayer, but we picked that up from the protestants. I made more than a few people mad for refusing to hold their hand, they took it personal. I was confronted a couple times and explained it wasn't personal it was improper. People finally figured me out and didn't even attempt to take my hand. I noticed the herd mentality when it started and watched it spread like sheep most people are. Most people don't question anything and have forgotten what the Mass is and why it is that way. If you go to a high Mass and understand the book of Revelation you will see it unfold during the Mass.
ReplyDeleteFor Example when the Priest takes the incense and circles the altar with the incense (swinging it) rising around it.
Rev. chapter 8:
"3And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne. 4And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand."
I hope that explains it for you.
ReplyDeleteYes it does thank you.
I guess I've always held the view that Vatican II wasn't necessary if the RCC was correct in its teachings. Although I'm not Catholic I have had the opportunity to travel and have been to masses in some of the worlds largest cathedrals. I've also been to many friends weddings and a few funerals. The Latin Mass does impart a feeling of awe that the local languages do not.
My understanding of what was going on was limited no matter what language was used. I pretty much bowed my head, stood, sat or kneeled when everyone else did. I did not partake of the Eucharist as that would have been a violation of the sanctity of the church.
Thanks for the link, I'll check it out.
ReplyDelete